For the dissolution of these United States

[Lurker]

Let me also add that a spearation of the states into two separate countries would result in the US abdicating its role as the sole superpower and pretty much ceding that role to China and perhaps a resurgent Russia.

I don't know about you but I think it is a good thing that the USA has the power that it does and don't think a world where China or Russia is the big man on the world stage is a good thing. But I guess I am just a liberal and you conservatives would be content halving our power and letting other countries take the lead.

And please, don't give me any fantasies that a conservative half of the USA would be anywhere near as powerful economically or militarily as the US, as one entity, is today.

[Atty Tude]

I don't agree, mate. It sounds so half-baked. Either you do it properly (secede), or you might as well not bother.

And yes, people in liberal states know how to use a gun. Ask any gang-banger there. And they are the ones the elite are going to sic on you.

[Firekrakka]

I've always said red counties need to secede

We live in a blue state which is determined by Cook county. however, our county is red. Go figure.

If there's a new Confederacy, can I join? I have good aim

[Lurker]

Perhaps I am taking a casual conversation too seriously and if so, I apologize. But do you really favor a path that leads to diminishing the US power on the world stage and watching China, Russia or perhaps a consolidated Mideast caliphate stepping into the role as world leader?

I don't know about you but I think our freedoms and rights would be in serious danger if we follow the scenario of secession. I would not want to be pushed around by those sorts of countries (or any country for that matter).

Myself, I am opposed to any division. I think both liberal and conservative parts of the country provide things to this great country that we would be weaker without. I know there is a conservative audience here but think about all the high tech companies (Microsoft, Google, Facebook etc) that reside in liberal areas of the country. We would lose a lot of high tech companies to the liberal side of the halved USA.

And lest you think I am only advocating the liberal side I will say that the energy industries and their technical innovations would reside more in the conservative side and the liberal states would suffer from the lack of it.

[NonLiberalInOregon]

Perhaps I am taking a casual conversation too seriously and if so, I apologize. But do you really favor a path that leads to diminishing the US power on the world stage and watching China, Russia or perhaps a consolidated Mideast caliphate stepping into the role as world leader?

"peace, commerce, and honest friendship with all nations, entangling alliances with none . . ."

Thomas Jefferson

If a portion of the United States were to secede, and revert back to a Constitutional government, as Atty suggests, then why care what happens in the rest of the world?

Those fools want to kill each other? Let'em.

People cry that isolationism can't work in the 20th / 21st Centuries. I disagree. If a Constitutional government existed, and provided for the common defense, as intended, rather than providing for the foreign defense (as we do now) then we should fear no one, and anyone that dares challenge us, gets blown off the face of the Earth.

I know, it sounds a little 3rd grade, but if it works...

Build your nation, defend your nation, and keep your nose out of other people's business = recipe for success. And I'm not talking defend your nation like we do now, with one eye closed and some nukes. I'm talking OLD SCHOOL, walls to cover the ground borders, AA to protect the skies, heavy naval coverage on jurisdictional waters and enough nukes to make anyone think twice about setting foot where they aren't welcome.

Simple as that.

If China, Russia or the Mideast wants to be a "world leader" (thereby painting a big target on their backs) let'em. We don't need to care what they do, so long as they don't do it to us. And if they do, we clean their clocks. Decisively.

To quote Tony Stark...

"That's how Dad did it, that's how America does it, and it's worked out pretty well so far..."

Dad = Founding Fathers, America = back before WWI & WWII, and it worked well for quite a long time.

[Justaguy]

Myself, I am opposed to any division. I think both liberal and conservative parts of the country provide things to this great country that we would be weaker without. I know there is a conservative audience here but think about all the high tech companies (Microsoft, Google, Facebook etc) that reside in liberal areas of the country. We would lose a lot of high tech companies to the liberal side of the halved USA.

The tyrant Lincoln thought the same thing. That said, if the US were to break up and a portion was to reclaim its Constitutional roots, with constitutional money, it would only be a matter of time before it was a powerhouse again. What made America great wasn't government intervention and social engineering. It was innovation, respect for capital, and the freedom to achieve. I believe you are 180 degrees out talking about the loss of rights and freedom. I believe rights and freedom would be enhanced by following the constitution.

[Lazarus]

As the global influence of technology gains ground there are an increasingly limited number of possible end results. Most of those focus on the supremacy of the State and the subjugation of the individual. It's difficult to argue otherwise because there is...and can be...little or no restriction on the use of technology by Big Brother. In practical application centers of power have always done as they pleased, at least until violently over thrown. Using technology for control can be done with a degree of secrecy that avoids repercussions for a long time...too long.

My purpose of this thread is to offer a place to discuss the possibility that a divided United States, left and right if you will, might in the long run be better for future freedom than the effort to preserve the big conglomerate of differing views we currently have as a nation. Or, in more blunt terms: I share no allegiance with DC or the East Coast. I view them as parasites. Divesting "fly over" country of the fringe might be best...

I have been of the opinion that this nation can no longer continue in its current state with the wide gulf of political opinions now... I would embrace the dissolution of this nation into smaller regional nation states made up of like-minded political views... Or at least we should spin off those states who adhere to social utopianism and let the rest of us embrace the original Constitution...

I am not one of those who believes that this nation must always exist in its 50-state incarnation... There is nothing magical about the number 50... The founders were embracing the ideals of freedom and liberty - not some overwhelming continental behemoth...

[Firekrakka]

Build your nation, defend your nation, and keep your nose out of other people's business = recipe for success.

Agreed!!!

[Lazarus]

I've always said red counties need to secede

We live in a blue state which is determined by Cook county. however, our county is red. Go figure.

If there's a new Confederacy, can I join? I have good aim

You know where God's country is, Peachy... The border is open to you at anytime... Tie Dave up and throw him in the trunk and come on down...

[Justaguy]

I've always said red counties need to secede

We live in a blue state which is determined by Cook county. however, our county is red. Go figure.

If there's a new Confederacy, can I join? I have good aim

I think everything below about... Peoria is red, isn't it?